Nov. 2, 2020
How Brand Advocates are Created by Successful Companies Worldwide with Andrew Deutsch
In this episode, host Eric Dickmann interviews Andrew Deutsch. Andrew is a multilingual global strategic marketing and sales consultant who has successfully driven business growth in more than 100 countries.
His company Fangled Technologies is a strategic marketing consultancy with services including Fractional CMO leadership, in-depth research beyond the financials for M&A, in addition to total branding and go-to-market strategy creation.
Eric Dickmann can be found on Twitter @EDickmann and LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/edickmann and my website https://ericdickmann.com
Andrew Deutsch can be found online at https://fangledtech.com on Twitter @Fangled_Int, and Facebook @FangledInternational
Episode Summary: The episode summary can be found at https://fiveechelon.com/brand-advocates-created-successful-companies-s3e5/
If you'd like to contact us with feedback or guest inquiries, please visit:
https://fiveechelon.com/podcast
For more information about Virtual CMO strategic marketing consulting services, visit The Five Echelon Group at https://fiveechelon.com
Episode #36
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WEBVTT
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andrew welcome to the virtual CMO podcast.
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Thanks so much for joining us today.
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Hey, glad to be here.
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Thanks for inviting me.
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You know, it's funny, that's called the virtual CMO podcasts, but we actually have two virtual CMOs here today, which is great.
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virtual CMO, fractional CMO.
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CMO.
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demand, whatever you want to call us.
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It's great to have some company on the show.
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Yeah, I was going to rename it.
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CMOs are us, but someone told me that was taken.
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Yeah, that's funny.
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That's funny.
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So I would love to hear, as we start out, just to give the audience a little bit of a background on yourself and how you came to start up a fangled tech, your consulting company.
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All right.
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originally the.
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Do age group.
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And I began my work years ago in central Florida, and then 10 years working in growing the business in the South of Brazil.
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And when I came back to the States, A troll had taken my name and registered it.
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then why did it hurt me for it?
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So at that same time I had gone to work for, one of my clients is as part of their company for a period of time.
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And decided when I came out, rather than fight with the troll and go through all the legal, I needed to come up with a clever name that really said who we were and, you know, got the brand recognition that we would want to going forward.
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So it was a conversation with some of the folks that we're working with and you know, what kind of a company are you.
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we're not new fangled cause we really do.
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What's great.
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We're not old fangled because we're moderate and we deal with it.
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So we're right in the moment we're fangled.
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And.
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Became Fangled tech.
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We were talking just before the broadcast started about the importance of a brand story and the ability for a brand to be recognized.
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And I've had a few guests on the show that, they'll wear a certain color.
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I had a nice lady on the show and she wore a pink scarf every time that she was doing a public appearance and another one at word green dress and a guy that wore a purple shirt or a tie.
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And it's nice to have something about your brand that's recognizable so that when people see you, they, equate your brand with you.
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Absolutely.
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And the thing is, everyone says your brand needs to be memorable, but memorable for the right things.
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You know, you don't want to be remembered for.
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The kinds of things that destroy brands you want to be remembered for the great work that you do.
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And the problems that you solve for your clients.
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That's so true.
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And I really want to get into that a little bit more with you because, we're both seasoned veterans.
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We've been around the game for a long time and in marketing, there's quite a breadth of skill that's out there.
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There are a lot of companies that tend to hire in young people, right out of school to manage their social media or whatnot.
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And oftentimes we also see that marketing is a function that is given off to another executive within the organization.
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A VP of sales and marketing.
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how do you look at the range of experience that's out there and really what differentiates somebody with experience in marketing with somebody who maybe doesn't have that season skill?
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it's something that I've been talking about quite a bit lately.
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The.
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there's a, an issue across the boards, outside of our field and in the U S and abroad now where folks value someone's confidence far more than their competence.
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So you get a kid right out of school who studied marketing and has a good understanding of it.
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But at the end of the day, what they really have as a tool kit.
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They know about SEO.
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They know about all of these pieces that are tools.
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The true seasoned marketing guys are the ones that recognize tools change every year.
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But the core of marketing is understanding how to build a strategy to really go back and say, who are our customers?
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What do they look like?
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What's their persona?
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What did they want?
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What are the problems that we can solve for them?
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Do I have one type two?
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I various types.
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And then really understand who they are, where they are, how to reach them and how to truly solve the problems that you now know that they have.
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Just because you use social media in your personal life, doesn't mean you're an expert in social media, right?
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Yeah.
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And it's fascinating to me, like for example, you'll come across somebody who will tell you, I know I'm successful in marketing because I can drive 200,000 people to a website a day.
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I can get someone 30,000 followers within a week.
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And you go, okay.
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But what does that do for you?
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Are those followers, people who could do business with you?
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Are you interested in vanity or prosperity?
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And most of my client work is in that, in the industrial sort of niche market space.
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So if you were to ask me, would you want 30,000 connections on LinkedIn?
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I would say, it depends are the 30,000 connections people who I can benefit, or we can do business with me.
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Or am I going to be trying to look for quality content out there and have to filter through all the garbage?
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I don't want to see.
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It has to be target.
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It has to be strategic in what you do.
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I love that phrase.
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You use a vanity versus prosperity because yeah, followers are relatively easy, but getting somebody to open up their wallet and actually buy something to spend money on a product or service is an entirely different proposition altogether.
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And I think many times people don't realize the challenge that you've got there.
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Yeah.
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And you know, I've tried at the supermarket to pay for my food with connections and they don't, they won't take it.
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They won't take my likes, my connections, any of that stuff.
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They want cash.
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It's so true.
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Cash is the currency that drives the world, not likes and followers, right?
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Absolutely.
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Absolutely.
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So there's this huge differentiation in skills within the marketplace, but at the same time, we're also seeing this move towards a lot of outsourcing towards more use of freelancers.
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I think there was a time when you would just go to an agency and they would be a one stop shop for everything.
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And agencies still have an incredibly important role to play.
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But now I think your choices are more diverse.
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you can have a bunch of different people working on your behalf.
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How do you see the landscape.
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we are not an agency and I make it clear that we're not, I have nothing against there's some real, like you said, some really good agencies out there, but many times I would say nine out of 10 clients that we take on are people that have been burned by agencies.
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there's all of these sort of what I call creepers in the fees.
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They agree, Hey, we're going to put together a print ad.
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And by the time they're done the project management fees are 10 times what the I'm exaggerating, but much higher than what the actual costs should have been.
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Or you go to the agency and they tell you, Oh, we've got a person who specializes in your field.
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And the reality is no one there has ever worked in your industrial sector before understands it.
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So rather than the way we do where we've got about a hundred different freelance people that we've been using for years, we build a team specific to the strategy and specific to the needs of the customer.
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With folks that are relevant within that area.
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But I think you also highlight another point is that there was a benefit in the agency model where you turned everything over to them because.
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They were also an ultimate point of responsibility, right?
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They were the person that you had a lead at the agency.
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And you could go to, if you didn't like something or something was wrong.
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When companies engage with a lot of freelancers.
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Then there has to be somebody who's coordinating that effort.
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Otherwise everybody's just off doing their own thing and there's no strategy.
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There's no continuity in what they're doing.
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And I think that's another way that roles like you and I play with a virtual CMO, fractional CMO.
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You still need somebody driving the bus.
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And that's what we do.
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But the difference is if in an agency model you've got the person running the agency.
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Sometimes they have a sales team who goes out that thinks that they know marketing.
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But they're really about just getting more and more out of it out of the customer.
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It's almost like an interior decorator situation where you're going to decorate your home.
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So you talk about a plan and before long, every napkin you buy for your house has a commission for them.
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Anthe design is more based on what furniture they get the best commission on.
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Whereas with what we do as a fractional CMO, we're part of the team.
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It's like having a part time employee with sea level credentials, who's there to build the strategy.
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So the responsibility is with that person.
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But the difference is: us fractional or however else you want to call it.
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We have a pool of people that are already vetted that we know what they're going to charge.
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We know how they work.
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We know what the project is.
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and we're used to working with them on projects specific to that customer.
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So there's no additional project management fees.
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Cause that's what we're doing in our monthly fee for the days or the number of hours that we've negotiated for.
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And when there's additional services and agency, when they outsource, they can double, triple whatever they're being billed.
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In.
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In my case, we actually show the invoice of what we're paying and there's a standard markup for us to manage that project.
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But at the end of the day, we own the project that the freelancers, if a freelancer screws up for us, we're on the hook, not the freelancer they're on the hook with us, but we were responsible to it just as if we were an employee of the company.
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Yeah, I think that's so important.
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And you know, I really want to get back to this statement that I made earlier because I see it so often and I'm sure you run into it as well.
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So many companies will come back and say, I already have a VP of sales and marketing.
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Why do I need to have somebody in a separate role?
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Just for marketing, isn't marketing, a function of sales.
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Yeah.
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Again, at other most common question that's asked and the reality is marketing makes it so that sales can happen.
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we understand.
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And we use the data that we get from sales to understand the customer a little bit better and the performance and otherwise, but to truly understand the total scope of the market to generate the leads to look at where is the low lying fruit, all of the analysis that's involved.
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In where to go to market new regions, being able to hone the messaging to create the materials, even building the CRM systems in conjunction with the sales team.
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So that the CRM is something that they can use and like to use as opposed to an administrative nonsense thing that drives them nuts.
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And I think that this also dovetails nicely into the conversation just on leads in general, because what I often see is when marketing is wrapped up underneath the sales function, everything is leads, but there's more to leads than just going out and going to the magic, lead bank and just purchasing some leads.
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There's awareness that drives interest that then begins to build demand.
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And it's a nurturing process where you have to take these leads and mature them before they can move over.
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And I think oftentimes when it's a sales function, there's the temptation to skip all that and say, where can I just quickly find some leads there?
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There's no quick solution.
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Yeah, there isn't but there, there's a lot of sales guys that have grown up with that kiss or kill sort of mentality.
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If I don't get it on the first run, go away.
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One of the big programs that we've built for many clients is exactly what you just called out a lead nurturing program.
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So for example, there was a, engagement that I was involved with that was selling a product through dealers and leads were coming into the website, hundreds and hundreds a day.
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And someone would just by zip code, send it out to the dealer and let it go.
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the question at hand, and this is where marketing comes in.
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Is, are the leads being handled?
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Are they actually contacting these people who said they're interested?
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Are they getting into the dealership?
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Are they selling the product?
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And if they do buy, are they buying theirs or are the leads that you're sending, enhancing your competitor?
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Who's also on that lot.
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So we built a lead nurturing program where the leads were first qualified.
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And a personal touch occurs and then introducing them to that dealer network.
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And then later.
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after the engagement, they were supposed to be able to follow up and gather all of that data to better know the performance of their dealers.
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When it comes to that, demand generation and building sort of a real funnel to attract new leads.
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Do you see in your experience that many companies truly don't have a good handle on what their unique value proposition is, what their true differentiators are.
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And instead it's price and features.
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Absolutely.
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I would say nine out of 10 companies.
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The first question that we always ask is tell me who your ideal customer is.
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And nine out of 10 times nobody can tell me.
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and when the 10th they can.
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When we dig into it and look at it.
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It's not who they thought it was.
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So I'll give you, I'll give you an example.
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We were involved in the steel drum industry for a number of years, and they were as an industry that this particular company was talking about.
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The fact that the drones were made of steel, they were tested in house.
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They had in house authorized government testing for DOD and transportation.
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They had high quality.
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All of this was there, their entire pitch, everything they were pitching is table stakes.
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These are all of the basic requirements just to be in that industry.
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If you want to sell steel drums.
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You have to be able to test in house.
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You have to do all of those things.
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So we dug in and started to talk to the top customers in the past.
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Customers.
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Why do you do business with this company?
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Number one response.
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Because Ithey answered the phone.
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Number two response.
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Cause when me as the buyer screw up or we get a run on a product, they're the only ones who can turn around and get them to me immediately.
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Other companies could take a month.
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Number three.
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At my salesman's in touch with me all the time and I can reach them anytime I want.
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Number four was when they screw up and they have a defective product, they own it and fix it within a day or two, not, we have a process.
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It'll be a month before we get back to you.
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So the entire reason that people were doing business with them had nothing to do with the quality of the product at all.
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It was, they met and exceeded all of the standards in the market.
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they were huge because people liked them and they got the service and resolved that the personal problems that buyers have in that industry.
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so obviously all of the messaging had to change the very differentiators they thought they had.
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First of all, it didn't differentiate anything.
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And second had no meaning to the customer.
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what you've really touched on, there is something that I'm such a firm believer in and it's this.
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Understanding of pain points.
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It's understanding how a particular product or service is actually going to solve a problem that is going to address some sort of a pain that the customer's having.
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Not what it does and all the capabilities that it has.
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Like you say, a lot of times that just ends up being table stakes.
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Chances are your competitor's products do very similar things.
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But how are you uniquely suited to solve a customer's pain points or a problem that maybe your competitor is not?
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And would you just describe her?
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A lot of service differentiators had nothing to do with the product.
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Yeah, it's it had nothing.
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I'll give you another example.
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Years ago, I was tasked with the U S manufacturer of sofas of upholstered goods.
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They were looking to get into the South American luxury market.
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And in the U S when you go buy a sofa, a real high end thousands of dollars sofa.
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They'll show you the inside of the sofa.
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They show you the Springs and how many directions it was hand tied in Brazil.
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You would talk about that and the consumer would go, I don't give a crap.
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literally.
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That means nothing to me.
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I want to know if it feels good.
00:15:06.317 --> 00:15:10.517
When I sit in it, I buy a sofa with my butt was the most common thing that I heard.
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I want a fancy, beautiful fabric.
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I want it to look nice.
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I want it to be comfortable and I want to be able to tell people I imported it.
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That was what mattered.
00:15:19.067 --> 00:15:23.956
So all of the collateral that existed in the U S for selling those sofas was useless in Brazil.
00:15:25.576 --> 00:15:37.966
I'm so glad you segwayed into this, because I really do want to leverage your experience working with global brands and talk a little bit about that, because I think that's a challenge as we become an increasingly global economy.
00:15:38.366 --> 00:15:47.506
businesses want to open up in new markets, but it's not as simple as, translating your content from English to French or the German.
00:15:47.907 --> 00:15:50.277
there's a lot of culture that's involved in this.
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And the term I always like to use is cultural translation.
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Just like you said, the same sofa here versus Brazil, but the way the consumer bought it Was very different.
00:16:00.246 --> 00:16:01.866
that's just a difference in culture.
00:16:01.866 --> 00:16:03.697
That's a different dish in buying behavior.
00:16:04.086 --> 00:16:10.657
So I'd love to hear about your experience and advice that you give businesses as their thinking to expand into new markets.
00:16:11.466 --> 00:16:14.616
The most common thing we encounter with a company that wants to go global.
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Is, Oh, we're already exporting so we know what we're doing.
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